Krishnamurti & the Art of Awakening
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Fire near KFA


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Wed, 06 Dec 2017 #1
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 382 posts in this forum Offline

There is currently fire in the Sulphur Mountain area of Ojai, which is quite close to the Krishnamurti Foundation of America. Hopefully it stays far away from the library, which houses important manuscripts and recordings and the houses where K lived and the orange groves.

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Wed, 06 Dec 2017 #2
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5233 posts in this forum Offline

Currently the fire known as the "Thomas" fire is 0 percent contained and ravishing Ventura some 15 miles away. The fire did breech the ridge that forms the southern boundary of the Ojai Valley this morning. I watched it happen from my home there. It has been hard to get any reliable information but I don't think Arya Vihara and Pine Cottage as well as the building housing the archives has, so far, been affected. When I hear more I will put it on the thread.

Arya Vihara (Pepper Tree Retreat), Pine Cottage and the Oak Grove School on the west end of the valley are presently OK. But they are still fighting the fire so nothing is definite yet.

This post was last updated by Jack Pine Wed, 06 Dec 2017.

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Wed, 06 Dec 2017 #3
Thumb_profiel Wim Opdam Belgium 1191 posts in this forum Offline

Jack Pine wrote:
Currently the fire known as the "Thomas" fire is 0 percent contained and ravishing Ventura some 15 miles away. The fire did breech the ridge that forms the southern boundary of the Ojai Valley this morning. I watched it happen from my home there.

Hi Jack,
Hope you and your fellow man stay safe as well as they can save a lot of nature too.

the building housing the archives

Has not the entire archive now been digitized with a backup elsewhere
and/or housed in a fire-safe situation ?

Truth will unfold itself for those who enquire their own actions and only to them and for them and to or for no one else.

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Wed, 06 Dec 2017 #4
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 382 posts in this forum Offline

Ojai weather forecast: humidity to remain extremely low for the next week. Winds about 10 mph.

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Wed, 06 Dec 2017 #5
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5233 posts in this forum Offline

Wim Opdam wrote:
Has not the entire archive now been digitized with a backup elsewhere
and/or housed in a fire-safe situation ?

One would hope so but I can't confirm anything.

Arya Vihara (Pepper Tree Retreat), Pine Cottage and the Oak Grove School on the west end of the valley are presently OK. But they are still fighting the fire so nothing is definite yet.

This post was last updated by Jack Pine Wed, 06 Dec 2017.

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Wed, 06 Dec 2017 #6
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 382 posts in this forum Offline

Mandatory evacuations include:
Carne Road east to McAndrew Road, Reeves Road north to Thacher Road
Since KFA is on McAndrew Road that puts them right on the border. Not sure if the mandatory evacuation applies there or not since it's on the very edge of where the evacuations are happening. But probably they're included.

This post was last updated by idiot ? Wed, 06 Dec 2017.

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Thu, 07 Dec 2017 #7
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5233 posts in this forum Offline

idiot ? wrote:
But probably they're included.

Unfortunately, they are included. Because as you pointed out some of KFA property is on McAndrew Road. KFA's property, Pepper Tree Retreat and Pine Cottage, are just a short way down the road, few hundred feet, from Thacher School and that is where one line of defense against the fire is presently set up. The wind tonight is predicted to be around 18 MPH which is much lower than it was. Still is too much wind. It's a "wait and see" situation.

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Thu, 07 Dec 2017 #8
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 382 posts in this forum Offline

“It looks pretty bad up there, but as of right now we have not lost any structures in the city of Ojai,” said Rudy Livingston, the city’s finance director, late Wednesday evening, December 6, 2017. The Thomas fire was 5% contained, mostly along the southeast flank in the Santa Paula area. Forecasters say strong Santa Ana winds, coupled with low humidity, could offer “a recipe for explosive fire growth.” KFA still at risk.

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Thu, 07 Dec 2017 #9
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 382 posts in this forum Offline

This is the most important Krishnamurti site in the United States! Arya Vihara (Pepper Tree Retreat), Pine Cottage where K lived. The pepper tree where the process began. The library/archive building that contains one of a kind manuscripts and the original audio and video sources of much material. The new dialogue building. Nearby homes of important supporters of K. The gardens and groves. If fire hits, the loss would be devastating.

There are many other spas and meditation groups in Ojai. Already on Meditation Mount in the Upper Ojai Valley, the fire burned a group's building and damaged the gardens, according to the organization's Facebook page.

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Thu, 07 Dec 2017 #10
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 382 posts in this forum Offline

LA Times reporting this morning, Thursday, December 7, 2017:

Ojai officials said it was “a miracle” that fierce Santa Ana winds had subsided on Thursday, as firefighters battled wildfires that have encircled the mountain community and continued to burn largely untamed on surrounding ridgelines.

“The fire burned hard overnight on slopes about four miles north of town,” Rudy Livingston, Ojai’s finance director, said. “But fire crews with bulldozers and fire engines … were able to reduce fuel, calm the flames and keep them from coming downhill into town.”

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Thu, 07 Dec 2017 #11
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 382 posts in this forum Offline

Some homes north of Ojai but far from KFA have been destroyed by fire. Evacuation remains in effect, Thursday. But the worst may be past?

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Thu, 07 Dec 2017 #12
Thumb_me_3_reduced_copy Patricia Hemingway Australia 1867 posts in this forum Offline

Thank you idiot and Jack for keeping us updated on this. It is very concerning.

Having experience (there's that word! but here used technically) of bushfires here in Oz, my heart goes out to all affected by such an overpowering force of nature.

I trust that you are correct idiot, and the worst is past for the KFA property. And that the fires will soon be under control.

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Thu, 07 Dec 2017 #13
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 382 posts in this forum Offline

I don't know if the worst is past for sure. The Thomas fire is expected to burn for a couple of weeks. But getting through last night's danger was important.

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Fri, 08 Dec 2017 #14
Thumb_me_3_reduced_copy Patricia Hemingway Australia 1867 posts in this forum Offline

Of course. Such fires are very unpredictable.

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Sat, 09 Dec 2017 #15
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5233 posts in this forum Offline

Hi Patricia, nice to hear from you. Been a long time.

The fire danger in Ojai seems to have passed. Arya Vihara and Pine Cottage appear to have survived. I'm going up there tomorrow morning to confirm that and to talk to my friend Michael Krohnen who works the library on Saturdays and some other days.

Also, the Oak Grove and the school of the same name are intact.

This post was last updated by Jack Pine Sat, 09 Dec 2017.

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Sat, 09 Dec 2017 #16
Thumb_me_3_reduced_copy Patricia Hemingway Australia 1867 posts in this forum Offline

Thank you Jack. That is so good to hear.

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Sat, 09 Dec 2017 #17
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 382 posts in this forum Offline

As of late Friday, December 8, 2017, evacuation orders are lifted. Very grateful to firefighters and relieved. No doubt KFA will want to assess preparations for disasters and have plans in place for any future dangers. Yes, plans and organization, as anti-K as that might seem. Nevertheless essential.

This post was last updated by idiot ? Sat, 09 Dec 2017.

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Sat, 09 Dec 2017 #18
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5233 posts in this forum Offline

I am pleased to report that I have visually confirmed that Pine Cottage, which is called the KFA Library, and Arya Vihara, which is the Pepper Tree Retreat, are intact and not damaged at all.

The fire that consumed so much acreage and buildings in the past five days appears to have moved on. There are still smoke plumes in the higher mountains to the north of the KFA property but I don't see any scenario where these fires could return. The fires have consumed the fuel that lies between were they now are and the Ojai Valley. So the fires can't return from where they appear to be now which is high in the mountains to the north and west.

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Mon, 11 Dec 2017 #19
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 382 posts in this forum Offline

Although the Thomas fire has moved on from Ojai, it has now become the fifth largest wildfire in modern California history and is threatening communities in Santa Barbara county. Ojai continues to have unhealthful air from the smoke.

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Wed, 13 Dec 2017 #20
Thumb_stringio BTeulada II Portugal 18 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

I received an e-mail this morning from the KFA with updates. There is also a notice that they have put up here : https://kfa.org/?mc_cid=0efaf9dc13&mc_eid=f...

I knew of the fire in CA but I did not realise how close they were to the KFA.

To Jack: I do hope you and your family, belongings, pets, whatever are ok. Last Summer all hell broke loose in mainland Portugal too. Many lives lost. So sad, just so terribly, unbelievably sad. Thinking of you.

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Wed, 13 Dec 2017 #21
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 382 posts in this forum Offline

Although KFA is undamaged, the Thomas fire did hit parts of the Besant Hill School in Ojai, formerly called the Happy Valley School, envisioned by Annie Besant and founded by Guido Ferrando, Aldous Huxley, J. Krishnamurti, and Rosalind Rajagopal. You can read about it here: https://www.besanthill.org/giving/fire-relief-f...

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Fri, 15 Dec 2017 #22
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5233 posts in this forum Offline

BTeulada II wrote:
To Jack: I do hope you and your family, belongings, pets, whatever are ok.

Hi B it has been awhile. Nice to see your smiling face again. My wife and I are fine except for the really bad air. It's full of fine ash that makes breathing it hazardous to one's health.

The fire is reportedly 35% contained. We can't see any more flames here just the smoke. My main home is in Colorado. I live in Ojai just in the winter, November to May, so I don't have too much stuff here to worry about.

This global warming situation is going to continue to cause problems for all of us around the world. And this country (USA) is going to be the main impediment to implementing a solution as long as we have a dangerously mentally ill president in the White House supported by ignorant, superstitious and otherwise mentally deficient religious fanatics who don't have the brains the "creator" gave to a shrimp. The Republican Party in general seems to be made up mostly of pimps for big business and billionaires while the Democrats are too chicken-sh*t to do anything but enable them.

Have you noticed how extreme religious belief seems to either lead to or be synonymous with insanity? Those of us who live in this country, which is rapidly becoming a fascist bastion, are seeing it first hand. And it's ugly. Believe me.

This post was last updated by Jack Pine Sat, 16 Dec 2017.

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Fri, 15 Dec 2017 #23
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5233 posts in this forum Offline

idiot ? wrote:
Although KFA is undamaged, the Thomas fire did hit parts of the Besant Hill School in Ojai, formerly called the Happy Valley School,

I hadn't heard that this school had been hit by the fire before your post above. It's not surprising however. The upper Ojai Valley, where this school is located, wasn't as lucky as the lower valley. The fire actually started along road 150 in the Upper Ojai. Also the Denison Grade, the serpentine road connecting the lower and upper valleys, was burned pretty badly too. My wife and I drove up there the other day. Still the firemen did a fantastic job saving the homes and citrus and avocado groves in the lower valley.

This post was last updated by Jack Pine Sat, 16 Dec 2017.

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Sat, 16 Dec 2017 #24
Thumb_stringio BTeulada II Portugal 18 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

Nice to hear you two are fine Jack. But otherwise so terrible. It seems it is still going on and made worse by the strong winds?

Jack Pine wrote:
Those of us who live in this country, which is rapidly becoming a fascist bastion, are seeing it first hand. And it's ugly. Believe me.

Oh I believe you.

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Fri, 22 Dec 2017 #25
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 382 posts in this forum Offline

As of today, December 22, 2017, the Thomas fire is now the second-largest in modern California history. It has moved on from Ojai and no longer threatens KFA property. The fire has burnt 272,800 acres and destroyed 1,063 structures. Many farms have been hit, as have olive and avocado orchards. It's still going. It is 65 percent contained, and continues to threaten 18,000 structures. Officials have not been able to determine what started the blaze. But clearly the lack of rainfall and extremely dry conditions in Southern California have fueled it.

This post was last updated by idiot ? Fri, 22 Dec 2017.

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Sat, 23 Dec 2017 #26
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5233 posts in this forum Offline

"Idiot" thank you for starting this thread. So much of what K left behind was close to being destroyed. The "teachings", of course, will live on no matter what any fire does. I would like to add an update to your last post if you don't mind.

"California's Thomas Fire has been raging for just over two weeks in Santa Barbara and Ventura counties, and it has already torn through hundreds of homes, more than a thousand structures, and over 273,400 acres of land. Now, as the Los Angeles Times reported late Friday, the fire has also burnt "its way into the history books," becoming the largest blaze ever recorded in the state's history.

"What should make Southern California fearful is that climate change could mean a future of more frequent and more intense wildfires."
—Los Angeles Times Editorial Board

"The fire eclipsed the 2003 Cedar fire in San Diego County, which burned 273,246 acres," the Times notes.

"The Thomas Fire has burned an area larger than New York City, Washington, D.C., and San Francisco combined—and larger than any city in California except Los Angeles," adds CNN's Nicole Chavez.

As of Friday night, the fire was just 65 percent contained, and firefighters are expected to be working around the clock until mid-January. President Donald Trump has yet to issue a major disaster declaration for Southern California.

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Sun, 24 Dec 2017 #27
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 382 posts in this forum Offline

Jack Pine, thank you for your direct, eye witness reports of conditions in and around Ojai, during and after this dangerous event.

When you look at a map of where the Thomas fire struck, it covers an enormous patch of California, but in the center is a hole with Ojai in it. Ojai was completely surrounded and yet survived. I don't believe in a god who controls such things. K always said that he was "protected" but I don't believe in supernatural protection either. Nevertheless, I am grateful that important K locations survived and will continue preserving and disseminating K's teachings.

This post was last updated by idiot ? Sun, 24 Dec 2017.

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Mon, 25 Dec 2017 #28
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5233 posts in this forum Offline

Ken moving the archives to England or anywhere else is a very bad idea and I will explain why.

The archives are housed in a building specially constructed to house and preserve these irreplaceable manuscripts and other papers. The environment inside the building is closely controlled in a vault-like room. The heat and humidity are regulated so as to preserve the paper and other artifacts. The building is virtually fireproof and earthquake resistant. The building was placed in an orange grove where most of the trees close to the building have been removed.

Even if the Thomas fire would have swept the area I doubt it would have had much of an effect on the building. There is also a fire hydrant on the property for fire fighters to use as a source of water to put out any fires.

As for England, well we all know how wet and generally unfriendly the weather can be. Not a good place to try to preserve anything from rot and mold.

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