We frequently explain all about what he talks in relation with authority, attachment, the condition of the follower, the significance of freedom from the very beginning, etc ., but we sometimes forget to talk about the way we understand this things for ourselves. Are we clear enough about the fact that at present is the time to realize our own possibility?
Excuse my English limitations, please. Regards, Angel.

Angel Miolan wrote:
Are we clear enough about the fact that at present is the time to realize our own possibility?

Hello madam,

Are you talking seriously? If you are serious on this issue, then you have to be there till issue is solved! Fire and fly away, don't show seriousness, so if you think this or any issue is serious, then you have to be there regularly to enquire it, not occasionaly for guest appearance:)

Now about the point you have raised, I feel It is always time to realise our own possibility, whether K or any other enlightened is there or not.

I don't know

This post was last updated by dhirendra singh Sun, 04 Apr 2010.

Querida Angel,

El pobrecito Dhirendra No entiende que los angeles no son permanantes mas son espiritas que viene y sale.

I was saying that one has to understand that an angel is a coming and going spirit.

And she speaks truly. seriously and logically. This using of K as an authority puts the poor man on a cross! It is a good Easter message for us.

But Angelita, remember Christ's last words, "Forgive them Father, for they know not what they do."

By the way, talking of crucifictions, I am halfway through reading En El Tempo De Los Mariposas by the Dominican authoress, Julia Alvarez. Have you read it Angel?

What are you waiting for?

dhirendra singh wrote:
Hello madam,

Paul Davidson wrote:
she speaks

Angel is a male, what happened to both of you? :)

Sorry Angel, they decided to change your sex. Unconsciously perhaps this lapsus is revealing something o;)

Well, I was following on from the learned moderator. Also, I never quite understood what gender an angel was.

Please forgive me. One thousand mea culpas!

In his book named 'Sex Matters' Osho states that he is neither male nor female, having transcended gender through intense sexual activity in previous lives. Hmmmmm

Angelito , , , descupame por favor. Yo no se lo que hago.

What are you waiting for?

Paul Davidson wrote:
remember Christ's last words, "Forgive them Father, for they know not what they do."

Is this a quote"as from an authority"?From a dubious source 2000 years ago?Seems somewhat of a double standard,shall we not then quote osho,georgie G,or any other?

THE TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREE

Paul Davidson wrote:
Well, I was following on from the learned moderator. Also, I never quite understood what gender an angel was.

Well sir,we see now the danger of following,anyone,do we not?Angels are described as being sexless.

THE TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREE

Paul Davidson wrote:
But Angelita, remember Christ's last words, "Forgive them Father, for they know not what they do."

According to others Christ's last words were"Father in to your hands I commend my spirit",I might be wrong,but I think it was the Gospel attributed to John.

THE TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREE

Thank you Chafia for your explanation about the male condition of this Angel.because the others, as Rick said are sexless. Was real funny the confusion generated...Angel

dhirendra singh wrote:
Are you talking seriously? If you are serious on this issue, then you have to be there till issue is solved! Fire and fly away, don't show seriousness, so if you think this or any issue is serious, then you have to be there regularly to enquire it, not occasionaly for guest appearance:)

Hello Dhirendra: I don't understand why are you suggesting that I'm going to post this question and stop participating in the develop of the collective inquire. Can you explain this to me, please? Regards, Angel.

Paul Davidson wrote:
By the way, talking of crucifictions, I am halfway through reading En El Tempo De Los Mariposas by the Dominican authoress, Julia Alvarez. Have you read it Angel?

Hi Paul: No, I don't read this book but I'm very aware about the topic of Mirabal sisters in the dictator Trujillo era.In this moment of my life I'm more interesting in the Message of K. Regards, Angel.

Paul Davidson wrote:
Well, I was following on from the learned moderator

This is becoming quite the comedy of errors. Although the moderator of this forum shares the last name of the poster Dhirendra Singh, I don't think they are one and the same person - as, according to their profiles, one hails from India and the other from Hawaii.

dhirendra singh wrote:
Now about the point you have raised, I feel It is always time to realise our own possibility, whether K or any other enlightened is there or not.

Hi Direndra: I feel your answer is very direct and clear about this point related to attachment to authority, in this case, K notion of authority.Angel.

Angel Miolan wrote:
In this moment of my life I'm more interesting in the Message of K. Regards, Angel.

Hi Angel,me too!

THE TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREE

Emma T wrote:
This is becoming quite the comedy of errors.

Well you know Krishnamurti did say in the teachings how important attention is.

THE TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREE

Chafia Abdi wrote:
Unconsciously perhaps this lapsus is revealing something o;)

Hi Chafia,

I understand your indication:) But I am not very familiar about english name, In India, name of Sikhist are same for male and female, But anyway for discussion, gender don't matter!

I don't know

Chafia Abdi wrote:
Angel is a male

Disappointed:)

I don't know

Angel Miolan wrote:
Can you explain this to me, please

OK, sir:)

I was not particularly pointing to you,I felt it common in K forum.

I don't know

RICK LEIN wrote:
According to others Christ's last words were"Father in to your hands I commend my spirit",I might be wrong,but I think it was the Gospel attributed to John.

Was John there?

RICK LEIN wrote:
Is this a quote"as from an authority"?From a dubious source 2000 years ago?Seems somewhat of a double standard,shall we not then quote osho,georgie G,or any other?

Feel free to quote whatever . . . but a quote need not be an authority. Depends what's going on in your mind. Thanks for putting the label 'dubious' on JC. Maybe we are all a bit dubious. What say you Rick?

I think the quote is interesting because we are normally taught to forgive them when they have understood what they have done and asked forgiveness. The 'dubious' character, Jesus, is saying forget repentance, just let it go. Precisely K's sentiments.

Angel Miolan wrote:
I'm more interesting in the Message of K

Good, but if one concentrates exclusively on one person doesn't one turn him/her into an authority? Actually Alvarez has some interesting psychological observations to do with how one addresses pain. It is not so far from K. Maybe you could get out more, Angel. Spread your wings a little - in your reading, I mean.

RICK LEIN wrote:
Angels are described as being sexless.

Then I think I must have met quite a few.

Emma T wrote:
Dhirendra Singh, I don't think they are one and the same person - as, according to their profiles

Now I see it - the moderator is more . . . moderate!

RICK LEIN wrote:
Emma T wrote:
This is becoming quite the comedy of errors.
Well you know Krishnamurti did say in the teachings how important attention is.

Yes, and also the trap of self-importance. Actually K loved comedy. It was very important to him. Learning to laugh at oneself is part of the serious mind.

What are you waiting for?

Emma T wrote:
This is becoming quite the comedy of errors. Although the moderator of this forum shares the last name of the poster Dhirendra Singh, I don't think they are one and the same person - as

It is said that a fool laughs three time on a joke, first time he laugh seeing others laughing, second time he laughs when he actually understand the joke,third time he laughs thinking that first time he laughed without any reason.I laughed three time today:)

You are right, not same person, But probably Paul has been awakened, so can't see difference:)

I don't know

This post was last updated by dhirendra singh Mon, 05 Apr 2010.

dhirendra singh wrote:
I was not particularly pointing to you,I felt it common in K forum.

Hi D! do you remember one more italian joke in the Last Talk Jk quoted. i dont remember exactly:)

I laughed at it many times. I dont know if Iam intelligent or fool.

We are watching, not waiting, not expecting anything to happen but watching without end. JK

This post was last updated by ganesan balachandran Mon, 05 Apr 2010.

dhirendra singh wrote:
It is said that a fool laughs three time on a joke, first time he laugh seeing others laughing, second time he laughs when he actually understand the joke,third time he laughs thinking that first time he laughed without any reason.I laughed three time today:)

You are right, not same person, But probably Paul has been awakened, so can't see difference:)

Lovely Dhirendra. I managed the fourth laugh with this one so I must be quite a fool! But I will let you have the last laugh knowing that he who laughs last, laughs loudest.

Incidently, yes I am asleep, even whilst writing. But I am hoping to wake up any day now. How about you?

What are you waiting for?

This post was last updated by Paul Davidson (account deleted) Mon, 05 Apr 2010.

Paul Davidson wrote:
Was John there?

Where you?

THE TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREE

Paul Davidson wrote:
The 'dubious' character, Jesus,

The dubious is in reference to the statement that you referenced as coming from Jesus,the question is,did it?

THE TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREE

Paul Davidson wrote:
Spread your wings a little - in your reading, I mean.

By all means,fill you head full of more knowledge,then speak from that knowledge,and continue refining your conditioning.

THE TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREE

Paul Davidson wrote:
But I am hoping to wake up any day now

The hope "is the dream",as K said in the teachings"remember those",while you go on hoping,you remain the same.

THE TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREE

RICK LEIN wrote:
Where you?

Rick, you are becoming too predictable!

What are you waiting for?

RICK LEIN wrote:
By all means,fill you head full of more knowledge,then speak from that knowledge,and continue refining your conditioning.

Rick, now you are becoming silly. From what emotional place do you write this kind of thing? Actually measure the emotion in it.

Rick, you obviously have a lot of knowledge yourself. You must be highly conditioned yourself. Let those who are without sin cast the first stone.

Is to read a book to become conditioned? If so then I suggest we all stop reading books, listening to K, or any interaction with life whatsoever. Then we will certainly all become very unconditioned.

Let's try and rise above this futile name-calling.

Surely the point in reading from any source, or indeed the point of any interaction with life, should be the gaining of understanding about oneself. I can use any source material as a mirror to myself. But this requires something rising above the automatic reactions to life and observing those reactions, the mechanical chain of life that passes through one.

Reading is as good a vehicle as many, especially if the book is well written and comes from the heart.

What do you read, Rick. Is it only K? Do you never go see a film. Do you not own a TV or radio? Do you never step out into the street?

You can never banish life (which is the source material of your conditioning). The point is to observe and understand the whole movement of life and then change ones relationship to it.

The psychological revolution can never take place in the ostrich. He hasn't the stomach for it.

What are you waiting for?

Paul Davidson wrote:
You must be highly conditioned yourself. Let those who are without sin cast the first stone.

Yes I am deeply conditioned,that is a fact ! One still questions this whole personalization aspect in the statements made.To feel attacked personally,is to react to a perceived threat to self image,is it not?

THE TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREE

RICK LEIN wrote:
To feel attacked personally,is to react to a perceived threat to self image,is it not?

Yes Rick, and the perception of a threat seems to trigger all sorts of negative defense reactions. It is common to all humanity (perhaps a few escape but not me!).

This 'self-image' is quite a thing. It is not an idle element. It acts. It is naturally violent.

The self-image is an image that there is a self. It is also the specific image of what that self is. It can be broken down into two parts.

One is the false personality. The false personality is the picture I have of myself that I would like myself to be - that is, without all the ugliness and contradictions.

Let's say that I have a personality, which is very simply the accumulation of all resistances I have made to the world, to 'life.' It is also all my knowledge and my so-called self-knowledge. It is my skills and achievements. It is the whole accumulation, my personal history.

This personality has nothing essential about it. It is totally and completely acquired through 'life.' But it is riddled with contradictions and full of holes and continuity gaps. If I could see the whhole of it at one time and without any preparation I woould probably go mad. This personality has very little to do with how I see myself but others may see it. If I am told I am like this or that, I deny it.

But to function in the world I need order and I need unity. My personality cannot give me that because it is chaotic and totally lacking any integrity whatsoever. Luckily for me however I have another function (of the emotion and the intellect) which is called, roundly, imagination. And with this admirable attribute I can fashion a picture or an image of myself which is both ordered and integral. It is much easier to imagine order than to actually create it. So I go with my imagination. I create a self image. This is an image of my personality which is totally false. That is why I call it false personality.

Now, this self image has to operate in its own name so I create a person called 'I' that is supposed to control and guide it. It is an image of a unitary self, totally at odds with the slightest examinable evidence. The more I insist on there being a unitary self in charge of the machine, the more I lie. Every time I say 'I' it is a lie.

But I see all this and I also understand that unless I have a sense of 'I' then I cannot survive in the world. I need something to interface with everyday life. I have manufactured something as a substitute for the real thing. For me, it seems a matter of life and death to protect this manufactured 'I'. Without it there is nothing else developed in me that would get me through life, nothing real besides this false 'I.' So, how can I throw it out? My whole body reacts and kicks back whenever the 'I' is threatened. I go into fight or flight response.

What are you waiting for?