Krishnamurti & the Art of Awakening
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You cannot invite truth


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Fri, 22 May 2020 #1
Thumb_donna_and_jim_fb_bw Tom Paine United States 3474 posts in this forum Offline

This was posted in a Krishnamurti group on Facebook today. Any comments? "You cannot invite truth, it must come to you; therefore don't seek it. Understand your own life and then truth will come darkly, without any invitation." J. Krishnamurti, 'A Light to Yourself'

Let it Be

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Fri, 22 May 2020 #2
Thumb_kinfonet_avatar Clive Elwell New Zealand 5946 posts in this forum Offline

Tom Paine wrote:

This was posted in a Krishnamurti group on Facebook today. Any comments? "You cannot invite truth, it must come to you; therefore don't seek it. Understand your own life and then truth will come darkly, without any invitation."

If one accepts that thought is not truth, then what could one do to invite truth? What would be the 'mechanism' for such an action? I cannot at the moment see that there is such a mechanism. And the QOTD is very relevant here:

Whatever effort the mind makes must be part of that from which it is trying to get away.

To invite truth, or to take any action at all 'towards truth' (whatever that might mean) implies that we in some way 'know truth', does it not? Know what truth is. But do we? Is truth a matter of knowledge, in fact? Can truth be known? All that we can know is knowledge, is it not?

It might be said that one do various things indirectly to at least "leave the door open" to truth, if it so happens to pass by. Such things as being generally quiet. 'Meditating'. Or NOT indulging in certain activities, like a lot socialising, entertainment and other occupations of the mind.

But do such actions, or negative actions, indicate a mind that is seeking something? That is, looking to the future for 'salvation'? Looking to the future means looking AWAY from the present. And truth might be right here, revealed when we are not searching for it in any way.

This post was last updated by Clive Elwell Fri, 22 May 2020.

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Sat, 23 May 2020 #3
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 182 posts in this forum Offline

Krishnamurti:
You cannot invite truth, it must come to you; therefore don't seek it. Understand your own life and then truth will come darkly, without any invitation.

First he says you cannot seek it. Then he says it will come if you understand your own life. So there is a way to truth: understanding your own life. But you must not go about understanding your life for the purpose of seeking the truth. Very funny. I mean, it may well be so. But it's funny that he says there's no way to it. But there is a way: understanding yourself. But don't do it as a way.

Why would you be interested in understanding your life at all? Only when you see and really feel the violence and conflict in the world will you be interested in watching your self, to be aware of your part in it, which is ending your part in it. And also ending you as a separate entity.

Do you take K as an authority and not seek truth just because he says you shouldn't? Or do you ask what is truth? Truth is the actual when thought has stilled and the quiet, open heart is. Can you seek it? Well, it doesn't come so much to the masses who live with little interest in such matters. You actually do have to have some kind of interest in these matters. Then you watch your own life, have awareness in relationship, put your house in order, and so on. You also realize that seeking is having a preconception about the sought. You are aware of what is, within and without, if there is a difference, silently watching it all. And then...

This post was last updated by idiot ? Sat, 23 May 2020.

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Sat, 23 May 2020 #4
Thumb_donna_and_jim_fb_bw Tom Paine United States 3474 posts in this forum Offline

Clive: To invite truth, or to take any action at all 'towards truth' (whatever that might mean) implies that we in some way 'know truth', does it not? Know what truth is. But do we? Is truth a matter of knowledge, in fact? Can truth be known? All that we can know is knowledge, is it not?

We must have some idea about it to invite it, of course. Some knowledge no matter how vague or nebulous. Some idea where it abides? Like the Christian who invokes his God. I am here now and Truth is somewhere else in space and time. But can you invite the unknown? Or only the known?

It might be said that one do various things indirectly to at least "leave the door open" to truth, if it so happens to pass by. Such things as being generally quiet. 'Meditating'. Or NOT indulging in certain activities, like a lot socialising, entertainment and other occupations of the mind.

But do such actions, or negative actions, indicate a mind that is seeking something? That is, looking to the future for 'salvation'? Looking to the future means looking AWAY from the present. And truth might be right here, revealed when we are not searching for it in any way.

Well, it IS right here. But the mind is lost in ideas, ideals and beliefs and concepts. Truth is not an idea or concept or belief. The mind is the barrier, or so it seems to me.

Let it Be

This post was last updated by Tom Paine Sat, 23 May 2020.

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Sat, 23 May 2020 #5
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 182 posts in this forum Offline

Tom Paine wrote:
The mind is the barrier.

Yes, the mind is the barrier. The mind is also the gate. To see it is to open it. Then it's gone! What a beautiful countryside to explore.

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Sat, 23 May 2020 #6
Thumb_kinfonet_avatar Clive Elwell New Zealand 5946 posts in this forum Offline

idiot ? wrote:
First he says you cannot seek it. Then he says it will come if you understand your own life. So there is a way to truth: understanding your own life. But you must not go about understanding your life for the purpose of seeking the truth. Very funny.

Looking at this logically, intellectually, it might seem there is a contradiction. Thought is full of contradiction, in fact. But if one is trying to understand one's life with a motive (the motive being achieving truth) then can there really be understanding? A motive means effort, doesn't it, and direction. Does direction lead to understanding? Or is direction distortion?

Surely I cannot direct understanding? It may be that understanding, when it comes, directs me?

Now if I accept the above intellectually, I can turn it into an idea, and that idea becomes another direction, another method to follow, although such following may be hidden. it seems the only 'answer' to this conundrum is constant alertness to the ways of the mind. Of course the mind can try to turn constant alertness into another idea, another direction - but constant alertness can see through this.

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