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THE LINK
Issue No. 27
PDF Version

The Newsletter
Editorial Note
by Javier Gómez RodrÃguez
Dear Friends
by Friedrich Grohe
Letters to the Editor
The old brain and the new:
a reply to Toward Understanding
Consciousness
A personal response to
Toward Understanding
Consciousness
The self of thought and the
self of insight
The importance of emotion
Considering self-inquiry
On the wordiness of the Link
K: The "feeling" of essence
Krishnamurti
Articles
Measure in the East and the West
by David Bohm
What is God?
Krishnamurti
The Way We Live
by Paul Dimmock
Interpretation Revisited
by Javier Gómez RodrÃguez
The emerging quality of the new brain
Krishnamurti
On Education
School in a Box - a visitor's view
by Kathleen Kelley-Lane, 2006
K: Mind is infinite
Krishnamurti
Knowledge and Dialogue in Education
by Javier Gómez RodrÃguez
K: Meditation is the passing away of experience
Krishnamurti
International Network
Thailand: Quest Foundation
Meeting of the International Committees at Brockwood Park 2007
Events
Theme Weekends at The Krishnamurti Centre, Brockwood Park 2008
L’éducation : Méthode ou Art de Vivre?
Summer Work Party at Brockwood Park 2008
Annual 'Saanen' Gathering, Switzerland 2008
Oak Grove Teacher's Academy 2007
Krishnamurti Summer Study Program 2007
Annual Gatherings in India, USA, Thailand
Announcements
Rishi Valley Institute for Educational Resources (RIVER)
School Without Walls
New Book
Obituaries
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| Measure in the East and the West
Most people who are at all observant
are now aware of an intense and pervasive
fragmentation of the entire fabric of
human life, both social and individual.
Such an awareness tends to give rise to
the urge to end this fragmentation so that
man may live in wholeness and integrity,
as he perhaps once did before the current
disruptive phase of human development
began. In the search for this sort of release
from fragmentation, many people are turning
to other cultures and other forms of
society, hoping that these may provide an
approach superior to the one that is now
dominant. Particularly in the West, more
and more people are beginning to feel that
perhaps in the East (especially in India)
such a superior approach still survives, in
the sense that religion and philosophy
emphasise wholeness and imply the futility
of a way of life based on seeing everything
as analysed into separate parts. It
may thus seem natural to suggest that we
drop our fragmentary Western approach
and adopt instead the Eastern way. This
way generally includes not only a view of
the self and the world that denies division
and fragmentation, but also techniques of
meditation intended to lead the whole
process of mental operation non-verbally
to that quiet state of smooth and orderly
flow needed to end fragmentation at its
very source, i.e. the chaotic, turbulent and
generally confused state of mind in which
we ordinarily tend to live most of the time.
To understand more deeply what is
involved in these questions, it is useful to
go into the difference between Eastern and Western notions of measure, for these
have been of crucial significance in the
development of the different general attitudes
to life that have come about over the
centuries in these two parts of the world.
Now, in the West, the notion of measure
has, from very early times, played a
key role in determining the general selfworld
view and the modes of living
implicit in such a view. Thus, among the
ancient Greeks, from whom we derive a
large number of our fundamental notions,
to keep everything in its right measure
was regarded as one of the essentials of a
good life (e.g., Greek tragedies generally
portrayed man’s suffering as a consequence
of his going beyond the proper
measure of things). In this regard, measure
was not looked on in its modern
sense as being primarily some sort of
comparison with an object using an external
standard or unit (e.g., so many inches
or pounds). Rather, this latter procedure
was regarded as a kind of outward display
or appearance reflecting a deeper ‘inner’
measure or proportion, which itself played
an essential role in everything. When
something went beyond its proper measure,
this meant not merely that it was not
conforming to some external standard of
what was right, but much more that it was
inwardly out of harmony, so that it was
bound to lose its integrity and break up
into fragments. One can obtain some
insight into this way of thinking by considering
the earlier meanings of certain
words. Thus, the Latin mederi meaning ‘to
cure’ (the root of the word ‘medicine’) is based on a root meaning ‘to measure’.
This reflects the view that physical health
is to be regarded as the outcome of a
state of right inward measure, or proportion,
in all parts and processes of the
body. Similarly, the word ‘moderation’,
which describes one of the prime ancient
notions of virtue, is based on the same root; and this shows that such virtue was
regarded as the outcome of a right inner
measure underlying man’s social actions
and behaviour. And again, the word ‘meditation’,
which is based on the same root,
implies a kind of weighing, pondering,
or measuring of the whole process of
thought, which could bring the inner activities
of the mind to a state of harmonious
measure. So, physically, socially and mentally,
awareness of the inner proportion or
measure of things was seen as the essential
key to a healthy, happy, harmonious
life.
measure is a form of insight
In this connection, it is instructive to
call to mind ancient Greek notions of measure
in music and in the visual arts. These
notions emphasised that a grasp of measure
was necessary for the understanding
of harmony in music (e.g., measure as
rhythm, right proportion in intensity of
sound, right proportion in tonality, etc.).
Likewise, in the visual arts, right measure
was seen as essential to overall harmony
and beauty (e.g., the ‘Golden Mean’). All of
this indicates how far the notion of measure
went beyond that of comparison with
an external standard, to point to a sort
of universal inner proportion, perceived
both through the senses and through the
mind.
As time went on, however, this notion
of measure gradually began to change, to
lose its subtlety, and to become relatively
gross and mechanical. Probably this was
because man’s notions of measure became
more and more routine and habitual, both
with regard to its outward meaning of
measurement relative to an external unit,
and also to its inner significance as a universal
sort of proportion relevant to physical
health, social order, and mental harmony.
Men began to learn such notions of
measure mechanically, by conforming to
the teachings of their elders or their masters,
and not creatively through an inner
feeling and understanding of the deeper
meaning of the measure or proportion
about which they were learning. So measure
gradually came to be taught as a sort
of rule that was to be imposed from outside
on the human being, who in turn
imposed the corresponding measure physically,
socially and mentally, in every context
in which he was working. As a result,
the prevailing notions of measure were no
longer seen as forms of insight. Rather,
they appeared to be ‘absolute truths
about reality as it is’, which men seemed
always to have known, and whose origin
was often explained mythologically as
binding injunctions of the Gods, which it
would be both dangerous and wicked to
question. Thought about measure thus
tended to fall mainly into the domain of
unconscious habit and, as a result, the
forms induced in the mind’s perception by
this thought were now seen as directly
observed objective realities, which were
essentially independent of how they were
thought about.
Even by the time of the ancient Greeks,
this process had gone a long way, and as
men realised this, they began to question
the notion of measure. Thus, Protagoras said: “Man is the measure of all things,”
thus emphasising that measure is not a
reality external to man, existing independently
of him. But many who were in the
habit of looking at everything externally
also applied this way of looking to what
Protagoras said. Thus, they concluded that
measure was something arbitrary, and
subject to the capricious choice or taste of
each individual. In this way, they overlooked
the fact that measure is a form of
insight that has to fit the overall reality in
which man lives, as eventually demonstrated
by the clarity of perception and
harmony of action to which it leads. Such
insight can arise properly only when a man
works with seriousness and honesty,
putting truth and factuality first, rather
than his own whims or desires.
The general rigidification and objectification
of the notion of measure continued
to develop, until in modern times the very
word ‘measure’ has come to denote mainly
a process of comparing something with
an external standard. While the original
meaning still survives in some contexts
(e.g., art and mathematics), it is generally
felt as having only a secondary sort of
significance.
Now, in the East, the notion of measure
has not played nearly so fundamental a
role. Rather, in the prevailing philosophy
in the Orient, the immeasurable (i.e. that
which cannot be named, described, or
understood through any form of reason) is
regarded as the primary reality. Thus, in
Sanskrit (which has an origin common to
the Indo-European language group) there
is a word matra meaning ‘measure’ in the
musical sense, which is close to the Greek
metron. But then there is another word
maya obtained from the same root, which
means ‘illusion’. This is an extraordinarily significant point. Whereas to Western society
as it derives from the Greeks, measure,
with all that this word implies, is the very
essence of reality, or at least, the key to
this essence, in the East, measure has
come to be regarded as being in some way
false and deceitful. Indeed, the entire
measurable structure and order of forms
and proportions that present themselves
to ordinary perception are regarded as a
sort of veil covering the true reality, which
cannot be perceived by the senses and of
which nothing can be said or thought.
It is clear that the different ways the two
societies have developed fit in with their
different attitudes to measure. Thus, in the
West, society has mainly emphasised the
development of science and technology
(dependent on measure), while in the East,
the main emphasis has gone to religion
and philosophy (which are directed ultimately
toward the immeasurable).
measure is illusion when it is
identified with the whole of reality
If one considers this question carefully,
one can see that in a certain sense, the
East was right to see the immeasurable as
the primary reality. For, as has already
been indicated, measure is an insight created
in man. A reality which is beyond man
and prior to him cannot depend on such
insight. Indeed, the attempt to suppose
that measure exists prior to man and independently
of him leads, as has been seen,
to the ‘objectification’ of man’s insight, so
that it becomes rigidified and unable to
change, eventually bringing about falseness
and deception in our overall apprehension
of the self and the world.
On the other hand, it would clearly be
wrong to accept the notion that measure is
inherently incapable of being anything
else but a false and deceitful veil of illusion,
covering the true nature of reality.
Rather, one may perhaps say that whatever
can be assimilated within the field of
measure is real, but is of a dependent conditional
sort of reality. What it depends on
is ultimately the immeasurable totality.
But this totality is not separate from the
field of measure. Rather, the immeasurable
overlaps and includes the measurable.
Or to put it in another way, all that
can be measured has its origin, its sustenance,
and its ultimate dissolution in the
immeasurable and indefinable which is the
creative source of everything. Nevertheless,
an adequate understanding of the
measurable aspect of reality as a whole is
evidently necessary for clear perception
and right action in every phase of life.
One may speculate that perhaps in
very early times, the men who were wise
enough to see that the immeasurable is
the primary and independent source of all
reality were also wise enough to see that
measure is insight into a secondary and
dependent aspect of this reality, which is
capable of helping to bring about order
and harmony in our lives. What they may
have said is, perhaps, that when measure
is identified with ‘the whole of reality as it
is’, this is illusion. But then, when men
learned this by conforming to the teachings
of tradition, the meaning became
largely habitual and mechanical. In the
way indicated earlier, the subtlety was
lost, and men began to say simply: ‘measure
is illusion’. Thus, both in the East and
in the West, true insight may have been
turned into something false and misleading
by the procedure of learning mechanically
through conformity to existent teachings, rather than through a creative and
original grasp of the insights implicit in
such teachings.
It is of course impossible to go back to
a state of wholeness that may have been
present before the split between East and
West developed (if only because we know
little, if anything, about this state). Rather,
what is needed is to learn afresh, to
observe, and to discover for ourselves the
meaning of fragmentation and wholeness.
Of course, we have to be cognisant of the
teachings of the past, both Western and
Eastern. But to imitate these teachings
or to try to conform to them would have little
value. However, to develop new insight
into fragmentation and wholeness requires
a creative effort even more difficult than
that needed to make fundamental new discoveries
in science, or to create great and
original works of art. It might in this context
be said that the one who is similar to
Einstein in creativity is not the one who
imitates Einstein’s ideas, nor even the
one who applies these ideas in new ways.
Rather, it is the one who learns from
Einstein, and then goes on to do something
original, which is able to assimilate
what is valid in Einstein’s work and yet
goes beyond this work in qualitatively new
ways. So what we have to do with regard
to the great wisdom from the whole of the
past, both in the East and in the West, is to
assimilate it and to go on to new and original
insights relevant to our present condition
of life.
In doing this, it is important that we be
clear on the role of techniques, such as
those used in various forms of meditation.
In a way, techniques of meditation can be
looked on as measures (actions ordered by
knowledge and reason) which are taken by
man to try to reach the immeasurable, i.e. a state of mind in which he ceases to sense
a separation between himself and the
whole of reality. But clearly there is a contradiction
in such a notion. For the immeasurable
is, if anything, just that which cannot
be brought within limits determined by
man’s knowledge and reason.
there is nothing positive man
can do to get in touch with the
immeasurable
To be sure, in certain specifiable contexts,
technical measures, understood in
the right spirit, can lead us to do things
from which we can derive insight, if we are
observant. But such possibilities are limited.
Thus, it would be a contradiction in
terms to think of formulating techniques
for making fundamental new discoveries in
science or creative and original works of
art, for the very essence of such action is a
certain freedom from dependence on others
who would be needed as guides. How
can this freedom be transmitted in an
activity in which conformity to someone
else’s knowledge or pattern of behaviour
is the main source of energy? And if techniques
cannot teach creativity and originality
in art and science, how much less is
it possible for them to enable us to ‘discover
the immeasurable’?
Actually, there are no direct and positive
things that man can do to get in touch
with the immeasurable. For this must be a
process immensely beyond anything that
man can grasp with his mind or accomplish
with his hands or his instruments. What
man can do is to give his full attention and
creative energies to bringing clarity and order into the whole of the field of measure.
This involves, of course, not only the
outward display of measure in terms of
external units, but also inward measure or
proportion, as in health of the body, moderation
in action, and meditation, which
gives insight into the operation of thought.
This latter is particularly important
because fragmentation has its root in the
kind of thought that goes beyond its
proper limits of harmony, by confusing its own content with a reality that would be
independent of thought. In the West, this
confusion has arisen, largely in the routine
and mechanical application of measure, in
such a way that everything is treated as
broken up into separate parts, because
the measurable limits of each part are
seen as independently existent realities. In
the East, a correspondingly routine and
mechanical approach through acceptance
of the authority of other people’s ideas
and techniques has rather generally led to
a fragmentation between the everyday
measurable aspects of reality and some
special immeasurable domain that would
be totally different (as well as between the
methods imposed by the authority and the
spontaneously creative responses of the
individual who tries to conform to these
methods).
fragmentation has its root in thought
that goes beyond its limit
To end this general fragmentation
requires intelligent insight, not only into
the world as a whole, but also into how the
instrument of thought is working. In particular,
what is needed is not the measurement of thought to determine whether it
has gone beyond its proper limits or not.
Rather, there has to be a kind of observation
from moment to moment of how
thought as a whole tends continually to
carry measurement into contexts in which
it is not relevant. This requires a creative
act of perception through the senses and
through the mind that contains its own
spontaneous discipline, not dependent on
the authority of another or on the imposition
of a technique for its order or its sustenance.
Through meditation involving
such perception and such spontaneous
discipline, thought will come to work in a
proper order, and the whole field of the
measurable will then be harmonious, so
that it can move in parallel with the
immeasurable.
This requires, however, that he give his
full creative energies to the enquiry into
the whole field of measure, and that he
drops his demands (generally implicit and
unexpressed) for some sort of guidance in
this enquiry. To do this may perhaps be
extremely difficult and arduous. But since
everything turns on this, it is surely worthy
of the serious attention and utmost consideration
of each one of us.
by David Bohm, 1973
© 1973 by Krishnamurti Foundation Trust Ltd.
(originally published in KFT Bulletin 17)
reproduced with permission from Sara Bohm
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