Krishnamurti & the Art of Awakening
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slakki zi's Forum Activity | 8 posts in 4 forums


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Forum: Serious Debate Fri, 19 Jun 2009
Topic: You are the World

I take I AM THE WORLD to mean simply that my thoughts and actions create the world (society). Remember the old saying "You can't see the forest from the trees"? I am at the same time the forest and the tree. Pretty simple. A serious observation I have made from JK teachings is to NOT over complicate matters, which the left brain (Self) has a tendency to do. Occam's Razor is a good rule to apply.

Forum: Serious Debate Fri, 19 Jun 2009
Topic: You are the World

Forgot to add ... There are many, many works that distill down to this position. For example, I would recommend watching and/or listening to JKs 1979 lecture on WHAT LOVE IS NOT and specifically the subtopic Can We Together Create A Good Society? Even his 1949 talks touch on this topic clearly.

Forum: Serious Debate Fri, 19 Jun 2009
Topic: The Oak Grove School: Is it teaching its students about conditioning or is it mearly just another prep school?

Terrence,

Given that a child is clearly developing mental representation as early as 18 months ...

Do you wish to teach teachers or children? Do you wish to start an institution, a program, or a class? Is your interest in the content or the method? And, most importantly, at what level?

Forum: K, psychology and the physical brain Fri, 19 Jun 2009
Topic: science, the I and ego,

I am new to this web site and it is quite impressive. I have read the whole of this thread and find this topic extremely interesting. However, my own background is deeply intellectual, experiential, and highly inter-disciplinary, and therefore I am having a tough time following this thread.

Firstly, words are being used freely one way here and one way there without regard to their actual definition. For example, ego is purely a psychological term, and is being used to describe something never intended. Today the word ego is used loosely across many disciplines. This makes it hard to communicate rationally. Words are only words but they need to be defined with precision and consistency, or this becomes a waste of valuable time for some. (Yes, I live in both places 100%)

Secondly, statements are being made as fact but the sources are not being cited to a degree which would allow others to investigate further. For example, with the field of biology uncovering new insights and discarding old theories daily, it is easy to get trapped into old science. NOT that biological confirmation of Self is necessary for experiencing Ks truth directly. On the contrary ...

And thirdly, it could just be me, and I don't mean this disrespectfully, but I sense quite a bit of egoistic, intellectual game playing in this thread. The logic and examples used could often be much shorter and clearer IMO. Ks teachings aren't all that complicated and shouldn't take that much verbage to explain conceptually. Some posts seem written to impress rather than to enlighten. At least to me personally. After "inquiring" for 52 years, I have learned how to identify patterns of gobbledegook.

I am aware that this thread could and does affect others differently. This is simply my reaction.

I am extremely busy with ALL of LIFE which prevents me from spending great lengths of time on any one forum on the web. BUT this is a wonderful site with passionate people, and I feel you do a great service representing Jiddu Krishnamurti and providing open discussions of his teachings.

If I may I will continue to post when I can.

Forum: K, psychology and the physical brain Fri, 19 Jun 2009
Topic: science, the I and ego,

I watched

http://video.google.de/videoplay?docid=-8085968916226888271

from your posts so I'm posting this in return

http://thesciencenetwork.org/programs/beyond-belief-science-religion-reason-and-survival

Dryer and much, much longer BUT possibly more scientifically accurate.

Cheers!

Forum: The Sacred Mon, 22 Jun 2009
Topic: Is thought thinking?

I have a hard time with this web site because I'm not sure whether it is a PUSH KRISHNAMURTI web site, or a USE JK AS A SPRINGBOARD web site. My instincts are to question and be skeptical of anyone or anything that wraps up the supposed truth in one "system". I'm pretty sure JK was expounding a process of understanding the world, NOT throwing out conclusions. I try to understand everyone's position in the world.

My observations have led me to the following ... Thinking is a process, only a tool which we can call upon to understand the world. Thoughts are the products of the thinking process. We have the ability to think concretely or abstractly. We can store these thoughts for later use, or abandon them altogether. There is no conditioning in thinking. Thinking is pure. It is a gun without the shooter.

Conditioning is the sum total of our emotional responses to real external stimuli. We are born with conditioning (instincts) and we acquire conditioning (experiences). If I am bitten by a dog at a young age, I will experience fear when I see a dog or have thoughts of a dog unless I work through it and recondition myself. Conditioning is in and of itself not bad. It is simply a tool of the organism to survive in the real world. It is NOT thinking. Apply this this idea in your own life and you will see that it is true. If there is a response you have to something real that doesn't appear to fit, I would like to know about it.

We experience the world through our five senses. These experiences have nothing to do with thinking or conditioning. To experience the world through our five senses without thinking or conditioning is indescribable. To do this one must learn to shut down all thinking and conditioning. People typically have a problem with this.

Behind the thinking, conditioning and experiencing there is a thinker, conditioner and experiencer. We spend enormous amounts of time trying to explain or describe WHAT this is, unsuccessfully. But I do know this..

IT directs and is aware of my thinking, my conditioning and my experiencing. IT has the ability to shut them all down, use one over the others, blend them, layer them, etc. You simply have to realize IT.

My personal belief is that JK made a left turn when he should have gone straight ahead. He didn't follow through. He elevated the ACT of shutting down our tools completely as the end of the journey. For me that was only the beginning of the journey, the first step toward self-knowledge. The next step was to integrate the whole organism, complete with IT, thinking, conditioning and experiencing.

This is NOT Krishnamurti dogma, this is my condition. Does this answer your original question? Any thoughts?

Forum: The Sacred Mon, 22 Jun 2009
Topic: Is thought thinking?

I have a hard time with this web site because I'm not sure whether it is a PUSH KRISHNAMURTI web site, or a USE JK AS A SPRINGBOARD web site. My instincts are to question and be skeptical of anyone or anything that wraps up the supposed truth in one "system". I'm pretty sure JK was expounding a process of understanding the world, NOT throwing out conclusions. I try to understand everyone's position in the world.

My observations have led me to the following ... Thinking is a process, only a tool which we can call upon to understand the world. Thoughts are the products of the thinking process. We have the ability to think concretely or abstractly. We can store these thoughts for later use, or abandon them altogether. There is no conditioning in thinking. Thinking is pure. It is a gun without the shooter.

Conditioning is the sum total of our emotional responses to real external stimuli. We are born with conditioning (instincts) and we acquire conditioning (experiences). If I am bitten by a dog at a young age, I will experience fear when I see a dog or have thoughts of a dog unless I work through it and recondition myself. Conditioning is in and of itself not bad. It is simply a tool of the organism to survive in the real world. It is NOT thinking. Apply this this idea in your own life and

Forum: Show 'n' Tell Mon, 22 Jun 2009
Topic: Ground

rachMiel ... wrote: for some reason i care deeply about the answer to the question: does there exist a permanent, absolute ground? i'm not sure why this matters so much to me. perhaps it's the classic human drive to make sense of the inexplicable by attributing it to a supreme entity. perhaps it's the Truth urging me to see it. perhaps it's something else entirely.

Classic human drive? Is it really? I think JK would ask why do you care so deeply? And that it is there you will find your answer.

Although I don't agree with everything JK says, I do believe this would be the proper action given your concern.

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